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[YASHI-non]

Hi all.

I just found this forum on the web and noticed that I live about 10 km north from the Admin of this site - nevertheless I will post in english here because it seems to me that this forum shall be developed to be an international forum.

Okay,

yesterday I purchased a NEW(!) YASHICA 109MP really for peanuts: 49 EUR including a YASHICA MC 3,5/35-70 lens at www.shphotoshop.de. It seems I picked the last one because the camera is no more listed today. This was a really hot tip from a friend I visited yesterday who purchased the camera some months ago.

I tried to connect my different old YASHICA ML lenses. They fit to the camera and everything was working. My question No. 1 to the honorable visitors of this forum:

Can I use all programs of the camera with the ML lenses or only AV?

In other words: can the camera set the aperture of ML lenses automatically? Can I damage the camera if I set the aperture of an attached ML-lens manually using the PROGRAM mode of the camera body?

I also own a Metz 45 CT-4 flashlight with SCA-adaptor system. My Y FX-D uses the SCA 380 adaptor which also works on the 109MP (confirmed by Metz support). Yesterday I also tried this combination with my friends camera and it was working - nevertheless question No. 2:

What is the correct setting of camera and flashlight?

It seems to me that AV (or PROGRAM) on the camera and TTL on the flash should be a working combination? What do you experts think?

[Markus]

First of all welcome :-)!

> YASHICA MC 3,5/35-70
Uh ... I guess this wasn't a fixed 3.5 one, or? :-)

> Can I use all programs of the camera with the ML lenses or only AV?
That depends on the lens ... honestly until now I didn't elaborate on a list of "MM" compatible ML lenses ... I remember seeing that the MC lenses in fact use the same method like the Zeiss lenses - smallest aperture in green -> MM functionality.

> Can I damage the camera if I set the aperture ...
No - because the MM/P functionality is more or less "programmatically". There is nothing mechanical about it other than the pin telling the camera it's a MM lens.

> What is the correct setting of camera and flashlight?
Hehe ... this depends on you shooting habits :-) ... ever noted the scale on the back of the flash? with that you can set the flahs and cam to manual ... and do everything manual.
The automatic flahs functionality should be explained in the 109 manual.
AV and P seems a good call.

[YASHI-non]

YASHICA MC 3,5/35-70
>Uh ... I guess this wasn't a fixed 3.5 one, or? :-)
-I don't know yet - the camera is still on shipment. What is and what's the problem with a "fixed 3.5"?

Can I damage the camera if I set the aperture ...
>No - because the MM/P functionality is more or less "programmatically". There is nothing mechanical about it other than the pin telling the camera it's a MM lens.
- So I think, I should compare the new MC lens with my old ML's and possibly find out what the hell the difference is ...

What is the correct setting of camera and flashlight?
>Hehe ... this depends on you shooting habits :-) ... ever noted the scale on the back of the flash? with that you can set the flahs and cam to manual ... and do everything manual.
The automatic flahs functionality should be explained in the 109 manual.
AV and P seems a good call.
Sorry to correct you: That has nothing to do with "shooting habits" - it is a technical issue!

Please let me explain:

A standard accessory shoe contains two electrical contacts: the shoe itself and the round contact plate on the bottom. If those contacts get shortened the flash starts lightning. This is done inside the camera body when the user presses the "shutter release"-Button. In the standard case the flash contains a sensor to measure and calculate the correct amount of light. Therefore it is neccessary to set the lens' aperture and the flash to the same f-number. So the flash knows the aperture-setting of the lens.

To transfer more "information" between flash and camera some more contacs are neccessary:
- ONE additional contact is used e.g. on my FX-D to let the camera electronic know that the flash is ready for lightning. This information is used by the camera to set the shutter speed automatically to 1/125 sec. If there is no "signal" on the contact the FX-D uses the actually measured and calculated shutter speed.
- TWO additional contacts can be used for a TTL-functionality. This is very useful - if the camera supports a TTL measurement. Through-The-Lens measurement means that the camera is able to measure and calculate within the moment of exposure. So even if the mirror is fold up the camera Sensor can measure and calculate exposure time or e.g. the amount of light from the flash. So using TTL mode on the flash is very comfortable as you don't have to care for any settings on the flash and the camera. During the exposure of the film the camera measures and calculates the correct amount of light and stops the flash when "it's enough".

Now unfortunately ...

1. the number of contacts allows no interference to the technologies available. There are too many differences between camera manufacturers and even models to anticipate what the contacts are used for.

2. There is nothing documented in the 109 MP manual!!!

Now what? Shooting a film just to test all flash options??

[Markus]

> What is and what's the problem with a "fixed 3.5"?
No problem ... and wrong wording on my side, it should have read "continuous" or something like that.

What I was aiming at is that there indeed is a

ML 35-70mm 1:3.5

whereas the MC version is having a changing initial aperture based on focal length
MC 35-70mm 1:3.5-4.5

unless there is a MC lens I don't know yet :-)!

[YASHI-non]

Okay, the camera came in today.
I have not taken a film yet, but I can state the following:

All (my) ML-lenses work properly with the 109M even in PROGRAM mode! There seems to be no technical difference between ML and MC. Only the printings on the lense are slightly different e.g. the highest f-number is printed in green to make the user aware that this has to be the setting in the PROGRAM-mode.

And I can also make an educated guess that the camera uses TTL-measurement when using a flash. The CS-140 system flash that I also ordered has no build-in sensor. And when I use the Metz flash with TTL-setting there is a big difference to using manual setting.

Let's see the first pictures I will take throughout the next weeks. I will let the world know. Stay tuned ...

[YASHI-non]

My first film was returned today from the lab service - and hey - I am really surprised: all my "speculation" was completely correct.

All ML-lenses work correctly also in program and AV-mode - even if the aperture is not set to the highest number. I discovered this by mistake: after taking some pictures in TV mode I set the aperture to 11 (instead of 22) when changing to program-mode. The pictures are still correctly exposed as long as the electronic sets the aperture to a much lower number.

So it seems totally correct to me what I found on the net these days: Yashica ML and MC lenses are technically identical. This change was just a change in the model palette and some changes in the lens coating. And - last but not least - the highest aperture number is printed in green on MC lenses to show the setting for program mode 

Even my hypothesis about the flash was correct. The 109MP uses TTL-measurement and all flashlight photos were exposed totally correct - even better then in the past without TTL.